1. ”Anders Behring Breivik, the main suspect in the Norwegian bomb attacks and shootings, has been described by police as a Christian fundamentalist with right-wing views.”
“Police chief Svinung Sponheim said that internet posting by Breivik suggested he has “some political traits directed toward the right, and anti-Muslim views”.
As I have written before, how many more people must die for Israel?
Let’s see if the horrible murderous Christian world will denounce these evil attacks as vociferously as they would have if some phony Jewish convert to Islam had committed them.
There is much more that will come out. Sure does look like some sort of operation. We’ll see.
2. Nice distraction from Hoare gate, no?
3. Coming soon, Elijah Cummings whoring for Israel. Plus much more. Much more.
”Anders Behring Breivik, the main suspect in the Norwegian bomb attacks and shootings, has been described by police as a Christian fundamentalist with right-wing views.”
THERE we go again!
CHECK Paul Joseph Watson’s “Oslo Police Conducted Bombing Exercise Days Before Terrorist Blast”
Breivik is Mossad’s patsy for sure.
Norway should declare war on israel.
signed, Timothy Oswald Sirhan
Leaves me wondering, where did Breivik get his weaponry? And the bomb making training and the guns and ammo he used at the Day Camp. Where oh freaking where might the ‘lad’ have been schooled?
School of the Americas? Uncle Cracker’s HomeSchool for Extreme Zionism in Uber-Action @ GutCheck, Kansas? IDF training camps for insane Hagee recruits in the Negev?
The Daily Mail had a weird picture of Breivik in his Freemason’s outfit which was lifted from his “Wiki” entry up yesterday…so this guy is a Christian Fundamentalist Freemason? WTF IS going on here? This one is going to take real careful analysis because the initial information is pointing everywhere and nowhere.
Bear in mind that the JWO wants to destroy BOTH Islam and Christianity…and fold them into Baha’i. So what does THIS story say to “non-violent atheists”?
What is the meaning of this post? Is it a spoof? What on earth is your point?
We are beside ourselves with grief for the innocent Israeli’s who have suffered so much from this trauma, and the Rabbis, who have yet to explain how this Rabid Christian fundamentalist has adversely affected the anti-BSD bill, and the braless reporters in Israel.[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_di6tmmFEOc&feature=related] We’re almost drowning in crocodile tears shed for the bunker dwelling ashkenazim children in Sdierot. Next year in Jerusalem. Oy.
Proves there are crazy people all over….I wish one of those kids would have had a pistol to fight back with. Crazies don’t care about gun laws. Crazies are just that CRAZY. Sometimes they can fake it for awhile, but whatever his motivation was…..it was still HIM that pulled the trigger and set off those bombs. Many, many people have strong opinions about everything from animal abuse to sex education, gay rights to obesity….and they don’t kill people. Blame him alone…..maybe his parents.
What will be the last straw? When will the world say enough already?
End zionism !!!….
Katarina Abin Hernandez
” … gay rights …”
MEANING?
THE SAVAGES WHO DESTROYED CIVILISATION
This is a very personal perspective which will not miss to enrage many who simply do not like it, the Black and the White, the religious and the so-called non religious, the ignoramus and the learned, the civilised and the savage, and the FOOL.
Western thought has bred many misconceptions and deliberately falsified conceptions about what is Black or White, religious or nor religious, civilised or savage, Western or Eastern, race or biological types, etc. This was and is still due to a fascist and racist belief (religious) system according to which, because of their military might, White Europeans who labelled themselves Western were and will remain for ever the master race, White Supremacists who boast of the greatest civilisation, past present and future. There is nothing farther from the truth. They also claim to be the only pure White “Caucasoid” race on this planet.
“Eastern” thought came to curb that Western arrogance mainly through Islam and give Mankind back its humanity and succeeded for some centuries to produce a far greater and more human civilisation than the Western racist one, not all by itself but by enriching itself with everything that was good in Western civilisation and in contact with Western cultures. But, it was soon to be overcome by the Evil present in all men and women. Those who embraced Islam became themselves decadent and allowed their civilisation to be destroyed, and themselves and their future generations to be enslaved by the worst elements of the West.
Western civilisation is inherently evil and warmongering and bent on global plunder and the worst kinds of immorality ever. It is the worst civilisation of all times despite all its achievement in most fields. It is devoid of spirituality, justice, brotherhood and sisterhood of humankind and immorality reigns supreme in all Western dominated lands. Today, we see the West embarked on a Crusade against plant, animal and human, against the human and other “species” and against nature itself as well as all the elements that sustain life on planet Earth which they have conquered for an eternal possession. They have claimed sole ownership of all land and water masses and even of space and the neighbouring planets. They even control and manipulate the seasons, the climate and the survival of our species.
The West has weaponised space and is ready and willing, even eager to blow up the entire planet and they have bred the right monsters to carry out this diabolical job: the Satanic Israelis, the greatest mass murderers, perverts, polluters, liars, thieves and the wildest creatures ever! So, my advice to all peace and justice loving and compassionate people on Earth is to NEVER TRUST anyone of them who is in any position of power! The concept known as the West is the greatest creation of SATAN and therefore the worst enemy of GOD or of what is regarded as GODLY values!
BAFS Sun 24.7.2011
P.S. STOP WATCHING TELEVISION! IT CAUSES BRAIN DAMAGE!
Breivik is a crazy, hate-filled, misguided individual. But he’s not a Christian. Interestingly there’s NO evidence that he is a Christian who accepts Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior of his life. No Christian would commit such a crime.
A Christian fundamentalist is someone that goes back to the Bible and takes it literally. If one reads for example the Beattitudes in the Gospel of Matthew, then these actions are definately not those of a Bible believing Christian. The media and Norwegian Police’s branding of this man as a Christian Fundamentalist is an insult to all Christians. In fact the Bible says that a Christians fight is not against flesh and blood, but against principalities and powers in the spiritual world.
You should read what he wrote to see what he believes. From the quotes I’ve seen, he doesn’t seem to be that religious. (I am not a Christian, so I am not trying to defend Christianity. I am just trying to discover the truth. It seems like some folks here have real axes to grind.)
Chili,
I did read what he wrote. He’s a Christian. If a Muslim had written similar material the media would be going nuts about the evils of Islam and McCants, Hegghammer and Haybeck would be writing books about how he got radicalized. And of course the outright crazies would be having a field day.
Hi Chili, you clearly have no understanding of the difference between the Christian and Islamic faiths. Please study the history of the founders of the faiths. The Quaran for example includes Surah 8 which is even known within some Islamic circles as the jihad Surah. When you contrast the teachings of Muhammed to those of Jesus, Jesus said “Blessed are are the peacemakekers for they shall see God” and “Blessed are you when people persecute you for my name sake, for great is your reward in heaven”. The Bible also says that no murderer will get to heaven – so according to the Bible, Mr Breivik has problems. Just a final word, people are not always what the claim to be. If someone claims to be a Muslim and uses that to justify their actions, then study Muhammed and what he did to see if their claims are valid. I someone claims to be a Christian and uses that to justify their actions, the study Jesus in the Bible to see if their claims are valid. If you study the teachings of Jesus you will see that the actions of this man are not consistent with that of a Christian.
Gavin Enslin | July 29, 2011 at 7:27 am |
“Hi Chili, you clearly have no understanding of the difference between the Christian and Islamic faiths.”
And, YOU, of course do, Gavin! Good. Thanks for your polite response. But, you do not seem to have a clue about what you are talking about when you repeat the western racist and fascist slogan about “jihad”.
Surah 8 Al-Anfal “Spoils of War” starts with GOD reminding the FREEDOM FIGHTERS who were attacked, their homes destroyed or taken away from them, their loved ones tortured, killed, themselves expelled or having to flee their homeland – and reminding them that all spoils of war belong to HIM, not to them to be looted.
Then, GOD orders the Freedom Fighters to perform the SALAAT and give CHARITY from what GOD gave them!
GOD tells them not to run away when attacked “unless it is a strategy of war”, but to face the enemy as He will protect them. The mention of Angels should not be taken literally.
GOD tells them that they will not be held accountable for the attacking enemy’s deaths they cause because they were defending their lives, property and way of life. GOD assumes that responsibility Himself.
GOD is exhorting the enemy to stop their war against the Believers and warning them if they don’t the war of self-defence will continue.
GOD asks the Believers to be loyal to their pledge to GOD and the Prophet and tell the enemy they will be FORGIVEN if they stop using their wealth to fight the Believers.
Verse 39 starts in one translation:
“And fight them on until there is no more persecution …”
Verse 70 speaks of FORGIVENESS for all the captives who REPENT (“have good in their hearts”), but not for the TREACHEROUS ones!
Verse 72 says:
Sahih International
Indeed, those who have believed and emigrated and fought with their wealth and lives in the cause of Allah and those who gave shelter and aided – they are allies of one another. But those who believed and did not emigrate – for you there is no guardianship of them until they emigrate. And if they seek help of you for the religion, then you must help, except against a people between yourselves and whom is a treaty. And Allah is Seeing of what you do.
GOD is telling the PERSECUTED Believers to EMIGRATE otherwise they will not be protected from EXTERMINATION!
Believers are required, including now, and especially now, to UNITE, to FIGHT with their wealth and lives (UNTO DEATH!) in order to protect their lives, the lives of their loved ones, their property and Way of Life chosen for the whole of Humankind and called in the Holy Qur’ân DIIN ISLAM.
When you mention that TERRIBLE WORD “JIHAAD” AS USED AT EVERY SINGLE BREATH BY THE WESTERN WARMONGERS AND MASS MURDERERS you have to be very careful and quote the Holy Qur’ân and in its proper CONTEXT!
In Surah 2 Al-Baqarah Verse 216, GOD ORDERS the Believers to FIGHT, TO SHOOT AND EXPECT TO BE SHOT AT, because they were ATTACKED! It was a DEFENSIVE confrontation. “War” is a modern term involving TRAINED AND WELL EQUIPPED ARMIES not small band of civilians like in those days. The JEWISH AND CHRISTIAN West anyway never fights wars against Muslims; they just BOMB, EXTERMINATE, STEAL, OCCUPY and ENSLAVE because they are the ones who are trained for mass killing and propaganda and well equipped for war, not the Muslims!
After promising Paradise to all the good ones among the Believing Jews, Christians and Muslims in Verses 198 and 199, GOD says in Verse 200 of Surah 3 ‘Ale-Imran in one particular translation:
(This was during a battle. Check it.)
O you who believe!
Endure (be strong, persevere…)
Be more patient (than your enemy)
Guard your territory by stationing army units permanently at vulnerable places from where the enemy can attack you
Fear ALLAH
So that you may be successful.
Now, I do not give a damn whether you have been polite or not in your answer, but you were visibly of no help at all in your commentary despite your good intention. The fact that you mention the term “jihad” without any context except mentioning Surah 8 which you happily point out “is even known within some Islamic circles as the jihad Surah”, but you failed to explain what you understand by JIHAD!
You went on contrasting “JIHAD” with your theoretical Christian “peacemakers” who you see BLESSED when they are PERSECUTED because of their religion and to whom GOD promises HEAVEN! I am just asking myself where the hell you saw here any difference between Christianity and Islam!
Why did you not quote the verse where the Bible says “no murderer will get to heaven” if you really wanted us to see for ourselves and maybe even understand?
“…study Muhammed and what he did…”
Why don’t you bloody tell us what he did?
“If you study the teachings of Jesus you will see that the actions of this man are not consistent with that of a Christian.” I would wholeheartedly agree on this one 100%!
But, tell us, Kevin, did Muslims or people who claimed to be Muslims carried out 9/11 (the 11/9/2001 explosions in the US) or 7/7 (London explosions of 7/7/2005)? If you can get these two answers right, then you are on the truth and our Brother and not lying and our deadly enemy! We can and must never disagree about provable facts.
Thanks and GOD bless.
Basheer
Hi Basheer,
1. Even your quotes talk about Muhammed saying it was ok to fight when attacked.
2. I have read the Quaran and have a copy of it in my bookshelf.
3. Secondly, Surah 9: 1 – 5 says this:
“A (declaration) of immunity from Allah and His Apostle, to those of the Pagans with whom ye have contracted mutual alliances:-
Go ye, then, for four months, backwards and forwards, (as ye will), throughout the land, but know ye that ye cannot frustrate Allah (by your falsehood) but that Allah will cover with shame those who reject Him.
And an announcement from Allah and His Apostle, to the people (assembled) on the day of the Great Pilgrimage,- that Allah and His Apostle dissolve (treaty) obligations with the Pagans. If then, ye repent, it were best for you; but if ye turn away, know ye that ye cannot frustrate Allah. And proclaim a grievous penalty to those who reject Faith.
(But the treaties are) not dissolved with those Pagans with whom ye have entered into alliance and who have not subsequently failed you in aught, nor aided any one against you. So fulfil your engagements with them to the end of their term: for Allah loveth the righteous.
But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, an seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them: for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.”
I have had numerous debates with Muslims who use this to justify acts of killing Christains in Islamic countries and I have listened to speaches from Islamic Clerics on Islamic TV channels defending the use of force to advance Islam.
The words of these 5 verses are not acceptable according to the teachings of Jesus. I don’t have time now to go further but there are 2 final points I want to make.
Firstly, the actions in Norway are disgusting and I condemn them absolutely. When 9/11 took place there were mass celebrations that took place throughout the Islamic world.
Secondly, I have no problem engaing with Muslim’s who are peaceful and allow my Christian brothers to freely practice their faith.
Lastly I am sorry that Muslims like you are tainted by acts of terror – but unlike Jesus, Muhammed faught wars and took slaves. This is according to Islamic traditions – and there is a great distinction there in our faiths. If you would like, we could continue the discussion contrasting our faiths.
God Bless
Gavin.
NOT DEAR GAVIN ENSLIN
You are a bloody fool and a liar and do not even have the skills to debate the issues at stake. When you talk to ME, you QUOTE me and not PREACH YOUR ZIONIST AND EVANGELICAL GARBAGE!
PROVABLE FACTS
Christians of whatever denominations have blood of hundreds of millions on their on their hands despite their Jesus-God
-who is not historical
- died miserably on the Cross (that Romans did not use for crucifixion)
- his Father refusing to hear his prayers
- his Father making him pay for the sins of others
- whose cowardly and treacherous apostles ran away and abandoned him to his fate
- who forgot to ask his illiterate disciples to write down HIS GOSPEL
- who warned against FALSE PROPHETS, but as soon as the first false prophet appeared on the horizon, RABBI SAUL OF TARSUS, Jesus chose him above all his Apostles to bring HIS NEW REVELATION to the uncircumcised Gentiles and not to the Israelites
- who forgot his own blood mother, brothers and sisters in HIS NEW GOSPEL and did not give a damn about them
- who promised the End of the World during his life time but it did not happen
- who promised another “comforter, advocate…” like him to confirm his Gospel IN THE NAME OF GOD, but who never came
- who sent the Devil himself to make THE ONE GOD a Trinity of Gods
- who ordered his apostles to buy weapons but then forbade them from using them
- who did not know that a fig tree does not bear fruits out of season
- who said by himself he could do nothing, but his followers made him the GOD CREATOR
SO, my good man, you do not have to tell lies about Muhammad and the Qur’aan when you already have God-Jesus on your side!
“But, tell us, Kevin, did Muslims or people who claimed to be Muslims carried out 9/11 (the 11/9/2001 explosions in the US) or 7/7 (London explosions of 7/7/2005)? If you can get these two answers right, then you are on the truth and our Brother and not lying and our deadly enemy! We can and must never disagree about provable facts.”
SO, you decided not to answer my questions after all proving (at least to me) that you have sided with Satan! I will therefore stop wasting my time with you. I have known thousands like you. THEY NEVER IMPROVE!
But, I will end on this note.
Roman Christianity was imperialistic and based on lies, lies, lies… genocide, global plunder and the slave trade! Were it not for Muslims, the Roman Jesus would have joined Brahma, Shiva and Vishnu, the other TRINITY of the Hindus!
Half of Christendom has left Christianity already and millions have become God’s enemies!
Pontius Pilate did not crucify JESUS THE SON OF THE FATHER but only JESUS THE KING OF THE JEWS! I bet you did not know this one! For this reason the Egyptian Christian Church (Coptic) CANONISED PONTIUS PILATE for saving the life of their MESSIAH JESUS THE SON OF THE FATHER, BAR ABBAS, THE SON OF MARYAM!
SO, don’t you preach your Greek fabricated religion to me – fabricated by anonymous authors on top of that! My time being too precious, I will not waste it again responding to you. SO, adios, my ENEMY!
I am a Christian of Christ (if there was such a guy) and not of Rome or of any Church, and as a Muslim (you won’t understand!), I was duty bound to respond.
No blessing this time, my boy! You had your chance and you blew it with your venomous propaganda! As I say sometimes, I do run out every now and then of both Christian and Islamic charity!
BAFS
Dear B.A,
Before you remove the speck from your neighbour’s eye, first remove the log from yours (edited quote). Gavin? Venomous?
))
God bless
A
Hi Basheer.
I am dissappointed with your final response as it seems rather angry. I was actually enjoying the interaction with you because I enjoy engaging all types of people.
You say my Christian beliefs are based on a lie. If you were prepared to engage with me you would find that my beliefs are not based on empty thinking and blind acceptance of the faith without any reason or logic. In fact, from your responces I will tell you that you understand very little about my Christian faith. From what I can tell is that all you understand about Christianity is what you have learnt through the teachings of Islam.
When I was about 22 years old I questioned my faith (which Christians are taught to do in scripture, while I have found Muslim’s are afraid to do) and so amongst other things I read the Qur’an. After my studies I was convinced that the Christian faith was correct and I have since experienced the work of God in my life in many areas. If you were ever interested, I would give you the story of my life.
One of the things I saw was that when Muhammed criticised the trinity in the Qur’an, he spoke of it as being God the Father, Jesus the Son and Mary the mother of Jesus (Surah 5: 119 and Surah 5: 75 – 76). This is not what Christians believe, and Christians have never believed this. The Christian belief of the Trinity is 3 persons in one, God the Father, God the Son (Jesus) and God the Holy Spirit. When I read these Surah’s, I had a problem accepting the faith. This Christian belief defininately predates Muhammed as there is not question that the New Testament existed in its entirety by about 300 AD at the latest, about 300 years before Muhammed was born. Errors like this were the reason that many Christians did not accept him as a prophet. I could give a lot more info on this if you wish.
Regarding blood that has been spilt by people who have called themselves Christians, this is something I do not deny and it is something I am ashamed of. However, Christianity had a reformation and this kind of violence is no longer accepted because it goes against the Bible. I do know a lot of Muslims that I believe are essentially good people and I repsect them far more that I do atheists and secular humanists because I can respect the way they adhere to values. I also adhere strictly to my Christian values. However, the Muslims I have met, can often make excuses for violence committed by Muslims, and I struggle to find Muslims who condemn violence committed by other Muslims (although I have met some).
Regarding the statement that half of Christondom has left Christianity also shows that you believe Islamic and Secular humanist propoganda. The church around the world is under attack like never before and yet it is growing like never before. In many countries Christians have to meet in secret and keep their faith a secret or they would face imprisonment and even death. I have a number of dealings with Christians in this countrey and there is a Christian worker that my church supports in a North African nation. Just today I was talking to a pastor who has done much work in the countrey of Mali so therefor much of what I know has been received through first hand accounts and not through propaganda.
Finally, please don’t use the news stations (like CNN or Sky) as examples of “Christian propaganda” because these channels are decidedly anti Christian.
Kind Regards.
TO
A21 | August 1, 2011 at 10:47 am |
I debate only with my equals and certainly not with pseudonyms unless there is a very good reason!
So, A21, if you have no comment to make about what I wrote (THE SAVAGES WHO DESTROYED CIVILISATION), which is the issue here, or the “Provable Facts” I listed above, you better shut up!
Christians are not in a position to teach Muslims anything when you are yourself completely messed up in your religion!
You look for “contrasts” and want to show your bogus superiority while I look for what UNITE us all – the good ones among us!
BAFS
In recent times we have seen expressions of extreme christophobia of the mainstream media (i.e. Time, Newsweek, Australian Broadcasting Company, etc.) ,which labelled western terrorists as “Christian fundamentalists,” for example, Anders Behring Breivik, convicted of horrific multiple murders in Norway. This is not the first time a western terrorist has been labelled “Christian”, although he was strongly anti-Christian. Timothy McVeigh , the Oklahoma City Bomber who killed 168, has often been called a “Christian terrorist,” although his final pre-execution public statement was a strongly humanist poem claiming, “I am the captain of my soul,” spitting in God’s face, as it were. Eric Robert Rudolph , who had nail-bombed an abortion mill in 1997 was likewise labelled a “Christian terrorist,” yet, Rudolph wrote in a letter from prison: “Many good people continue to send me money and books. Most of them have, of course, an agenda; mostly born again Christians looking to save my soul. I do appreciate their charity, but I could really do without the condescension. They have been so nice I would hate to break it to them that I really prefer Nietzsche to the Bible” (Nietzsche, the anti-God philosopher widely known for his “God is dead” pronouncement).
What about Breivik? Breivik specifically denied that he was a religious Christian , caring nothing for God and Christ: “If you have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ and God, then you are a religious Christian. Myself and many others like me do not necessarily have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ and God. We do however believe in Christianity as a cultural, social identity and moral platform. This makes us Christian” (No, it doesn’t). Even the anti-Christian atheist and champion of evolution, Richard Dawkins, said of himself: “I’m a cultural Christian in the same way my friends call themselves cultural Jews or cultural Muslims. It appears “Christian” can mean anything today.
It would have only taken a minimal research to find out that Breivik , in addition to loving the HBO TV series “Dexter” that portrays a serial killer favourably, liked the anti-Christian 19th century philosopher, John Stuart Mill, and did not list the Bible among his reading material, which is most unusual for a “fundamentalist,” a term which historically refers to defending the inerrancy of the Bible and other fundamentals of the Christian faith.
Finally, even arch-atheist Richard Dawkins knows this: “There are no Christians, as far as I know, blowing up buildings. I am not aware of any Christian suicide bombers. I am not aware of any major denomination that believes the penalty for apostasy is death. I have mixed feelings about the decline of Christianity, in so far as Christianity might be a bullwork against something worse.”
Rayburne F. | August 23, 2011 at 8:27 pm |
“In recent times we have seen expressions of extreme christophobia of the mainstream media (i.e. Time, Newsweek, Australian Broadcasting Company, etc.) ,which labelled western terrorists as “Christian fundamentalists,…”
Very good commentary, but I would not quote Pr Richard Dawkins, the animilogist, on anything. I have caught him lie so many times. The last quote you gave of him is in stark contradiction with what he said and wrote hundreds of times.
“There are no Christians, as far as I know, blowing up buildings. I am not aware of any Christian suicide bombers. I am not aware of any major denomination that believes the penalty for apostasy is death. I have mixed feelings about the decline of Christianity, in so far as Christianity might be a bullwork against something worse.” (Richard Dawkins)
When Christians bombed Vietnam, what were they doing? When the Jews bombed Beirut and palestine? When the Russians bombed Grozny? When the Serbs bombed Sarajevo? Dawkins argues that Christians and Muslims or believers in GOD are MAD, DELUDED and so on!
By the way, there is no such thing as Christophobia or Islamophobia! Nobody is afraid of Christ or Islam. Many are simply indoctrinated (mainly by Jewish Supremacists) to hate both religions and both people, but mainly to hate Arabs and Muslims!
Regards
Basheer
Hi Basheer, the last time I responded to you your called me “a liar and a bloody fool” and “my enemy” to quote you as you insist on being quoted. You are sold out on Islamic propaganda. In your last comment to me you asked what proof I had that 9/11 and 7/7 were carried out by Muslims. Well I would like to ask for your proof that Vietnam was bombed by Christians. After seeing your latest comment I decided to respond to beliefs you have that have been fabricated by so-called Islamic Scholars. And this time I’ll quote you …
“Christians of whatever denominations have blood of hundreds of millions on their on their hands despite their Jesus-God” John 1:1-4 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. (2) He was with God in the beginning. (3) Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. (4) In him was life, and that life was the light of men.
-who is not historical – Where do you get this trash from? This is the same rubbish that is propagated by secular humanists in Western universities. Jesus was a real person and the earliest manuscripts of the New Testament date back to 90AD – less than 60 years after the cricufixion when there were still witnesses to the crucifixion.
- died miserably on the Cross (that Romans did not use for crucifixion) – Again, where do you get your sources regarding crosses not being used for crucifixion. There were various shapes used – some stakes, some X shaped, some Y shaped and some the t shape that you see on churches. This statement reflects ignorance on your part.
- his Father refusing to hear his prayers – The only place where this occurred was on the cross recorded in Matthew 27: 46 and Mark 15: 34. I could explain this to you, but I would have to explain the whole Gospel to you for this. If you were interested I would do so – but this statement reflects your complete ignorance regarding Christianity.
- his Father making him pay for the sins of others – The difference between the Christian God and the Muslim God is that the righteousness of the Christian God cannot allow any sin to go unpunished. As all people have sinned, mankind had no hope. Jesus paying for man’s sin was prophesied by the prophet Isaiah in Isaiah 53 – you may want to read it as the prophecies of Isaiah were written about 600 – 700 years before Christ.
- whose cowardly and treacherous apostles ran away and abandoned him to his fate – Again this shows your ignorance. This story is recorded in all four Gospels :
Matthew 26:50-55
“ Jesus replied, “Friend, do what you came for.” Then the men stepped forward, seized Jesus and arrested him. (51) With that, one of Jesus’ companions reached for his sword, drew it out and struck the servant of the high priest, cutting off his ear. (52) “Put your sword back in its place,” Jesus said to him, “for all who draw the sword will die by the sword. (53) Do you think I cannot call on my Father, and he will at once put at my disposal more than twelve legions of angels? (54) But how then would the Scriptures be fulfilled that say it must happen in this way?” (55) At that time Jesus said to the crowd, “Am I leading a rebellion, that you have come out with swords and clubs to capture me? Every day I sat in the temple courts teaching, and you did not arrest me.”
- who forgot to ask his illiterate disciples to write down HIS GOSPEL – Firstly, Matthew and John were both Jesus Disciples and they both wrote Gospels. Secondly, Mark was a companion of Peter’s and Luke was a Greek doctor who wrote the Gospel of Luke and the Acts of the Apostles. 4th, James the brother of Jesus wrote an Epistle, Peter wrote two Epistles, Jude wrote an Epistle, John wrote 3 Epistles and the Revelation (the last book of the Bible). Again I believe that you have believed secular humanists in Western universities as these were some of the arguments they came up with in the 19th century and these theories are still taught in universities today. This study method is called documentary hypothesis. Many of their views have been proved false by archaeological evidence discovered in the last 100 years and many historians from the time of antiquities now view the Gospel writer Luke as one of the most accurate historians of that ear.
- who warned against FALSE PROPHETS, but as soon as the first false prophet appeared on the horizon, RABBI SAUL OF TARSUS, Jesus chose him above all his Apostles to bring HIS NEW REVELATION to the uncircumcised Gentiles and not to the Israelites – Paul preached to both Jew and Gentile – please react the Acts of the Apostles in the Bible. Secondly – Saul became Paul – because he started out trying to kill Christians and got radically saved. The other apostles also preached to Gentiles – for example read the letters to the 7 churches recorded by the Apostle John in Revelation 1 – 3. Your point hear is absolutely meaningless and reflects serious ignorance on your part.
- who forgot his own blood mother, brothers and sisters in HIS NEW GOSPEL and did not give a damn about them – Again, this shows ignorance. All you know is Islamic propaganda about Christianity. Here are the verses you’re probably referring to:
Matthew 12:48-50
He replied to him, “Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?” (49) Pointing to his disciples, he said, “Here are my mother and my brothers. (50) For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.”
He had not forgotten who His mother was, He was making a point that those who did not believe in Him did not understand. His point – He had come to enable mankind to get back into the family of God – a position they lost in the Garden of Eden.
- who promised the End of the World during his life time but it did not happen – please give me your reference on this one. In a previous comment you demanded a Bible reference to the comment no murderers will be allowed into heaven. You break your own rules.
- who promised another “comforter, advocate…” like him to confirm his Gospel IN THE NAME OF GOD, but who never came –
You refer to the promise of Jesus made in …
John 14:26
But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.
Please read Acts 2, 3 and for the account of the coming of the Holy Spirit.
- who sent the Devil himself to make THE ONE GOD a Trinity of Gods According to Genesis 1, mankind was made in the image of God, Mankind according to the Bible has three parts – a body, a spirit and a soul. God is one God with 3 parts just like man. I do not expect you to understand this. I a previous comment I also gave references from your scripture that Mohamed got the trinity wrong saying it was God, Jesus and Mary. You criticise what you do not understand.
- who ordered his apostles to buy weapons but then forbade them from using them – Again please give me your reference from the Bible. Not sure if you’re talking about Luke 22:36?
- who did not know that a fig tree does not bear fruits out of season – The point of this story was that the fig tree was not producing figs in the season where it was supposed to produce fruit – that was why He cursed it.
- who said by himself he could do nothing, but his followers made him the GOD CREATOR – Convenient to only quote things that help your point. You’re quoting
John 5:19
Jesus gave them this answer: “Very truly I tell you, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does.
Now reading this verse alone, you can twist things and claim this point. If you read the rest of John 5, you’ll find that Jesus made this statement to His enemies – the Pharisees that wanted to kill Him. He made this statement in order to show that His authority came from God in heaven. You see this same Gospel records these words of Jesus …
John 10:24-30
The Jews who were there gathered around him, saying, “How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly.” (25) Jesus answered, “I did tell you, but you do not believe. The works I do in my Father’s name testify about me, (26) but you do not believe because you are not my sheep. (27) My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. (28) I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. (29) My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. (30) I and the Father are one.”
Further on in the Gospel of John one of His disciples asked Him to show them the Father said … “he who has seen Me has seen the Father.”
The last thing I want to say to you is that I do not see you as my enemy because people kill their enemies. I am well able to defend my faith and have read numerous Islamic literature on the Christian faith and what you have said is typical Islamic rhetoric which shows that you don’t know as much as you think you know about Christianity.
Lastly- unlike you, I don’t judge your religion by the things certain bad people that call themselves Muslims do. I also do no always judge Islam by what Muslims say, I judge Islam by what the Quran and the Hadith says – Because at the end of the day that is what Muslims implement when they take over a country. You sir, on the other hand, find things evil people have done in the name of Christianity – people who are not what they say they are. For a correct assessment on what Christianity really teaches I challenge you to read the whole New Testament. All you know about Christianity is what other Muslims have told you. I also want you to know that I DO NOT condone any violence whether it is committed in the name of Islam or Christ because that is what Jesus taught, and I am your equal even though your religion teaches you otherwise. Also, I am not a “bloody fool” because I have read the Quran – and I can see that you have not read the Bible for what it is.
Gavin | August 24, 2011 at 9:31 am |
“Hi Basheer, the last time I responded to you your called me “a liar and a bloody fool” and “my enemy” to quote you as you insist on being quoted. You are sold out on Islamic propaganda. In your last comment to me you asked what proof I had that 9/11 and 7/7 were carried out by Muslims. Well I would like to ask for your proof that Vietnam was bombed by Christians.”
Nice boy to remind us that I called him “a liar and a bloody fool” although without telling us of the context. If that was the case, Gavin must really take me for a fool like himself to believe that I will read more lies by him and reply to him.
He is kind enough again to remind us that I asked him what proof he had that 9/11 and 7/7 were carried out by Muslims, but he does not say if he had provided us with his answers.
So, why waste my time with such a fool? He must come up with something more intelligent and relevant to the current exchange for me to take him seriously. There is hope, GOD willing.
Basheer
Hi Basheer, I quote your words …
“So, why waste my time with such a fool? He must come up with something more intelligent and relevant to the current exchange for me to take him seriously.”
Firstly, I really admire how serious you are about your faith. I really respect you for that because so many peope I come across believe what is convenient in the moment.
But, you are calling me a fool without understanding my beliefs? My view is also that the real reason you dont’s take me seriously because you have no answers – so you call me a fool and claim that I am not your equal.
You have not answered my rebuttles in any of the comments you have made.
One further comment I want to give you from Jesus is this …
Matthew 5:21-22
“You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘Do not murder, and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.’ (22) But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, ‘Raca,’ is answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.”
So sir, you had better hope that you are right in your beliefs, as you are very angry and you have called me a fool on numerous occassions. According to the Bible, you are in danger of the fires of hell because of what you have called me. But don’t worry, for it the Quran is right – then you’ll be ok. But does not make sense to me on how the 5 pillars of Islam will get one into paradise, and it doesnt make sense that a person could be a good Muslim all their lives and yet they die without knowing for sure that they’ll be allowed into heaven. I also don’t get why the only people guaranteed of heaven according to Islam are those who die in a Jihad.
I will pray for you – because one day we will ALL face God on judgement day. All I want to say to you is this, God loves you with a love you can never understand. That is why the Bible says He’d want to have a relationship with any person that will fear Him.
Regards Gavin.
Gavin | August 25, 2011 at 5:49 am |
“But, you are calling me a fool without understanding my beliefs?”
If I was wrong I will apologize and correct myself, but you say that I do not understand your beliefs. This is not a fact because it has never been question of peoples’ beliefs as long as they do not seek to harm others. I respect all such peoples’ beliefs. My niece and part of my family are Hindus as well as Christians. One worship Mary as the Mother of God and the Queen of Heaven and the other worship the half elephant and half man God Ganesh as their God of success. It is out of question that I insult their beliefs by merely saying so.
“I will pray for you – because one day we will ALL face God on judgement day. All I want to say to you is this, God loves you with a love you can never understand. ” Gavin
I always pray for all good human beings and for Sinners to be guided so that they may change their evil ways. But, I do not share that Christian belief “God loves you” which the Evangelicals use to convert people to Christianity. To me this is meaningless unless we say GOD loves people who believe in the One and Unique GOD and DO RIGHTEOUS DEEDS! Christians are “saved” by faith, but Muslims are ordered to DO RIGHTEOUS DEEDS AFTER FAITH! This is a fundamental difference in our belief system.
Love
Basheer
Dear Basheer,
Christians are not saved by faith alone. James 2:24 says: “You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone”. So there is no difference with regard to good works being a requirement. However, that does not mean God does not love those who don’t do good works. He loves everyone and wants every single person to turn to Him. Those that do the works of the Evil one are also loved by God, however they themselves, of their own will, turn away from God – He never turns away from them, He never gives up, and He is infinitely merciful, so even if a person committed something horrible, as long as he repents – God forgives.
Hi Basheer, thanks for this reply.
1st – you cannot compare Christianity and Hinduism.
2nd – the official position of the Catholic Church is that people can pray to Mary to ask her to intercede for them to Jesus. There are some Catholics that worship Mary – however, this is no the official position of that Church.
However, as I have said before, if you want to find out what Christians believe – READ THE BIBLE. You will not find “Mary worship” there. This practice is what originally split the church into Catholic and orthodox. Later in the middle ages there was a further split into Catholic and Protestant. The difference between Catholics that worship according to the true teachings of the church and non-Catholics is that Catholics believe one is not good enough to go directly to Jesus and so they need and intermediary between themselves and Jesus. Protestants and orthodox and Coptic Christians all do not believe this. Knowing one person who says they are a Christian does not mean you understand Christianity. You’ve got to read the Bible for yourself, if you really want to understand Christianity.
Also, if you were to attend a Catholic church service and you were to listen to the liturgies you find that the thoughts expressed in those liturgies line up very closely with those of the Protestant beliefs. The stuff with Mary happens outside that.
3rd – When people believe in Jesus and are born again, they change. In fact, the “doing” in Christianity is far more difficult than the “doing” in Islam. Christians, for example, are commanded to forgive ALL wrongs committed against them, to LOVE their enemies and PRAY for the persecutors. It’s easy to fight those who commit evil against you (our human nature wants to do that automatically).However, it’s so hard to forgive those that have hurt you – especially if they have killed some in your family or raped your daughter etc. Islam allows you to retaliate when people attack you – Christians do not have that luxury. When they do it, they have failed and need forgiveness. Looking at this and other examples, for me personally, the “doing” of Islam is easy compared to the “doing” of Christianity because for me to forgive those that have REALLY hurt me and are continuing to hurt me and fight me is SO tough.
Finally, here is the most descriptive passage on Mary in the Bible. You will see that there is no mention of worshipping Mary here, nor will you find this ANYWHERE in the Bible….
Luke 1:26-55
“In the sixth month, God sent the angel Gabriel to Nazareth, a town in Galilee, (27) to a virgin pledged to be married to a man named Joseph, a descendant of David. The virgin’s name was Mary. (28) The angel went to her and said, “Greetings, you who are highly favored! The Lord is with you.” (29) Mary was greatly troubled at his words and wondered what kind of greeting this might be. (30) But the angel said to her, “Do not be afraid, Mary, you have found favor with God. (31) You will be with child and give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus. (32) He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give him the throne of his father David, (33) and he will reign over the house of Jacob forever; his kingdom will never end.” (34) “How will this be,” Mary asked the angel, “since I am a virgin?” (35) The angel answered, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called the Son of God. (36) Even Elizabeth your relative is going to have a child in her old age, and she who was said to be barren is in her sixth month. (37) For nothing is impossible with God.” (38) “I am the Lord’s servant,” Mary answered. “May it be to me as you have said.” Then the angel left her. (39) At that time Mary got ready and hurried to a town in the hill country of Judea, (40) where she entered Zechariah’s home and greeted Elizabeth. (41) When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the baby leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. (42) In a loud voice she exclaimed: “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the child you will bear! (43) But why am I so favored, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? (44) As soon as the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy. (45) Blessed is she who has believed that what the Lord has said to her will be accomplished!” (46) And Mary said: “My soul glorifies the Lord (47) and my spirit rejoices in God my Savior, (48) for he has been mindful of the humble state of his servant. From now on all generations will call me blessed, (49) for the Mighty One has done great things for me— holy is his name. (50) His mercy extends to those who fear him, from generation to generation. (51) He has performed mighty deeds with his arm; he has scattered those who are proud in their inmost thoughts. (52) He has brought down rulers from their thrones but has lifted up the humble. (53) He has filled the hungry with good things but has sent the rich away empty. (54) He has helped his servant Israel, remembering to be merciful (55) to Abraham and his descendants forever, even as he said to our fathers.”
Regards Gavin.
Gavin Enslin | August 31, 2011 at 4:36 am |
“Hi Basheer, thanks for this reply.
1st – you cannot compare Christianity and Hinduism.”
Of course, I can and I will as the Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva TRIMURTI came before the Catholic God, Jesus and Holy Ghost TRIMURTI or TRINITY!
“2nd – the official position of the Catholic Church is that people can pray to Mary to ask her to intercede for them to Jesus. There are some Catholics that worship Mary – however, this is no the official position of that Church.”
The Roman Catholic and Apostolic church WORSHIPS MAY AS THE MOTHER OF GOD and the QUEEN OF HEAVEN. Full stop!
“However, as I have said before, if you want to find out what Christians believe – READ THE BIBLE.”
Sorry to disappoint you, Gavin, but I KNOW and READ more Bible than most (99%) of the Christians who try not to debate with me but PREACH their Sectarian religion to me (and push it down the throat of others) and make me waste my precious time. Even the name of “Bible” should be changed.
Love
Basheer
Hi Basheer – if you know the Bible so well then please give me your biblical reference where Christians are told to worship Mary.
Please quote the Bible and not some other source.
If you want to talk about what we worship, Islam is not above reproach. Muslim have a hard time explaining why you walk 7 times around a rock, and that all prayers around the whole world must face that rock. Then you claim you’re not worshipping the rock. In Christianity if you bow before a rock it is equated as worshipping the rock. In your Islamic world view it makes perfect sense to bow before a rock without worshipping it. But in the Chrisitian mindest you only bow before that which you worship. I could easily throw that accusation at you – but then I would be misrepresenting your religion – is that not so? Well that’s what you’re doing to my religion – MISREPRESENTING IT.
You keep making claims about Christianity that DO not come from the Bible – and as I said before – Mary is not part of the Biblical trinity. Your arguments indicate that you only read parts of the Bible other Muslims tell you to read. You continously quote things THE BIBLE DOES NOT SAY!!!! So, as far as Christianity is concerned, you do not know what you are talking about.
Cheers Gavin.
Gavin Enslin | August 31, 2011 at 11:21 am |
“Hi Basheer – if you know the Bible so well then please give me your biblical reference where Christians are told to worship Mary.”
DEAR GAVIN
Do you know what is an Internet TROLL?
1. I am the friend and a Brother of Christians and I am not here to demonise the “Bible” a term wrongly used for GOD knows what!
2. I saw a Jewish sponsored and kosherised French film once called
“Rabbi Jacob” in which Louis de Funes (?) said something like that: When you ask a Jew a question, he never replies but ask you another question. This gives him time to concoct an answer.
3. You seem to have a problem reading and understand what I wrote:
1st – you cannot compare Christianity and Hinduism.”
Of course, I can and I will as the Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva TRIMURTI came before the Catholic God, Jesus and Holy Ghost TRIMURTI or TRINITY!
“2nd – the official position of the Catholic Church is that people can pray to Mary to ask her to intercede for them to Jesus. There are some Catholics that worship Mary – however, this is no the official position of that Church.”
The Roman Catholic and Apostolic church WORSHIPS MAY AS THE MOTHER OF GOD and the QUEEN OF HEAVEN. Full stop!
With your sterile ‘arguments’ , we are getting nowhere, so I better stop here as my time is too previous to be wasted with Bible thumpers. You had your chance. My charity stops here.
Basheer
So he is a Christian terrorist!!! So Christianity preaches terrorism and all Christians are terrorists!!! well thats how the world sees the Muslims so why not even view the Christians the same way!!!